Steve Armstrong

May 11, 2016 Episode Page ↗
Overview

Dan Harris and Steve Armstrong, a meditation teacher and editor of "The Manual of Insight," delve into the "progress of insight" – the stages of experience leading to nirvana through intensive meditation, a topic often avoided by Western teachers.

At a Glance
14 Insights
1h 12m Duration
14 Topics
10 Concepts

Deep Dive Analysis

Introduction to the Progress of Insight and Steve Armstrong

Steve Armstrong's Personal Journey to Meditation

Mahasi Sayadaw and 'The Manual of Insight'

Understanding Enlightenment: Beyond Grandiose Ideas

Prerequisites for Experiencing the Progress of Insight

The First Three Knowledges: Mind-Body, Conditionality, Characteristics

The Fourth Knowledge: Arising and Passing Away (A&P) and Spiritual Goodies

Why Western Teachers Avoid Discussing the Progress of Insight

The 'Dark Night' Stages: Dissolution, Fear, and Disillusionment

Re-observation and the Path to Equanimity

The Culminating Experience: Falling into the Unconditioned (Nibbana)

Controversy and Secrecy Around Nibbana and Path Attainments

Maintaining Human Conditioning After Insight Experiences

Possibility of Achieving Insight for Busy Individuals

Progress of Insight

A sequence of predictable experiences and stages one allegedly goes through with intensive meditation practice, culminating in Nirvana. It is described as a 'how-to' guide or 'operator's manual' for enlightenment.

Nirvana (Nibbana)

The culminating experience of the progress of insight, described as being free of suffering and entanglement. It involves seeing moment-to-moment life as it truly is, free from delusion, illusion, and acquired assumptions or beliefs.

Nama Rupa (Knowledge of Mind and Body)

The first knowledge in the progress of insight, where one clearly recognizes that in every moment, something is being known. This is a basic awareness of the raw fact of existence and what is happening.

Knowledge of Conditionality

The second knowledge, where one realizes that phenomena do not happen randomly but arise due to causes and conditions. It involves understanding the interdependence of mind and body, such as intentions leading to physical actions.

Three Characteristics

The third knowledge, where one comprehends the fundamental qualities of experience: impermanence (things are constantly changing), unsatisfactoriness (dukkha, meaning things are unstable and insecure), and selflessness (conditioned, lacking an inherent, stable self).

Arising and Passing Away (A&P)

The fourth knowledge, characterized by the rapid perception of moments of experience arising and passing away, without the mind stopping to react or form cognitive stories. This stage often involves intense clarity and the emergence of 'spiritual goodies'.

Pseudo-Nibbana (Spiritual Goodies)

Highly attractive experiences like ecstasy, bliss, joy, rapture, effortless energy, soaring faith, and unshakable equanimity that arise during the A&P stage. They are called 'pseudo' because people can mistake them for actual Nirvana, and clinging to them is considered a 'corruption of insight'.

Vanga Ngana (Knowledge of Dissolution)

A challenging stage following A&P, often referred to as the 'dark night.' Here, one viscerally experiences that both objects and the 'knower' arise and pass away simultaneously, leading to a dissolution of the sense of a permanent self, which can be unsettling and induce fear or disillusionment.

The Unconditioned

Another term for Nirvana or Nibbana, described as a reality that is not dependent on causes and conditions. Accessing it is a momentary visit by the mind that profoundly and permanently transforms it, uprooting doubt about the path and the belief in a stable, enduring self.

Paramis

The forces of purity in the mind, including generosity, loving kindness, understanding, truthfulness, energy, and resolve. Cultivating these qualities in daily life is considered essential for preparing the mind for liberating insight.

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What is the 'progress of insight'?

It refers to a series of predictable experiences and stages that one will allegedly undergo if they engage in a significant amount of a specific type of meditation, ultimately leading to Nirvana.

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Why have American meditation teachers largely avoided discussing the 'progress of insight'?

Teachers have been reluctant due to the concern that Westerners, being very intellectual, might become overly obsessive or strive too hard to achieve these stages, which can impede actual progress, or might mistake early pleasant experiences for full enlightenment.

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What is 'enlightenment' in the context of the progress of insight?

It's described as a very grounded, ordinary experience of moment-to-moment life unfolding free of suffering and entanglement, seeing the nature of being human without delusion, illusion, or acquired assumptions and beliefs.

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Do you have to be on a meditation retreat to experience the progress of insight?

While not strictly necessary, retreats are highly recommended for most people to receive guidance, settle the mind, and become familiar with the terrain of their own heart and mind, making it easier to progress.

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What are 'spiritual goodies' or 'pseudo-Nibbana' in meditation?

These are highly attractive experiences like ecstasy, bliss, joy, rapture, effortless energy, soaring faith, and unshakable equanimity that arise during a certain stage of insight, but are considered 'pseudo' because clinging to them can corrupt further progress.

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What is the 'dark night' in the progress of insight?

It's a challenging stage (the Knowledge of Dissolution) that follows the pleasant 'spiritual goodies,' where one viscerally experiences the dissolution of a stable self and the impermanence/unsatisfactoriness of all phenomena, often leading to fear, confusion, and disillusionment.

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What happens when one 'falls into the unconditioned' (Nirvana)?

It's described as a momentary visit by the mind to a reality not dependent on causes and conditions. This experience profoundly and permanently transforms the mind, uprooting doubt about the path and the belief in a stable, enduring self.

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Can one still be a 'jerk' after experiencing advanced stages of insight or Nirvana?

Yes, according to Steve Armstrong, individuals retain their human conditioning, including aversion, desire, conceit, and pride, which can manifest as 'jerkism' or unskillful actions, indicating that full enlightenment (arhantship) is a further stage.

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Is it possible for a busy person with a full life to experience the progress of insight?

Yes, daily meditation practice, regular retreats (even annually), staying informed, and consciously practicing 'paramis' (generosity, loving kindness, patience, etc.) in daily life can prepare the mind for liberating insight, and some people achieve stream entry outside of retreats.

1. Practice Paramis Daily

Consciously practice virtues like patience, generosity, loving-kindness, and non-reactivity every day to prepare your mind for liberating insight, as this is crucial even outside formal meditation.

2. Sustain Daily Meditation

Maintain consistent daily meditation practice (e.g., 1-2 hours) to keep the thread of awareness going and support your spiritual progress.

3. Attend Meditation Retreats

Go on meditation retreats for deep immersion into the mind, allowing you to settle in, understand your inner workings, and gain a different perspective on life.

4. Observe Your Mind’s Workings

Become familiar with how your mind works by observing it, which helps you see life as it truly is and reduce reactivity and recreational distractions.

5. Question Acquired Beliefs

Put aside assumptions and beliefs acquired from family, culture, and education, as they may be fantasies not aligned with your deepest experience of reality.

6. Avoid Obsessive Striving

Approach spiritual practice without obsession or excessive striving, as trying too hard can impede your progress and lead to an unskillful attitude.

7. Recognize Pseudo-Nirvana

Be aware that pleasant experiences like ecstasy, bliss, and joy (pseudo-Nirvana or spiritual goodies) are temporary stages, not the ultimate goal of enlightenment.

8. Cultivate Equanimity Towards Bliss

Cultivate equanimity towards pleasant spiritual experiences and avoid clinging to them, as attachment can prevent further progress beyond the ‘arising and passing away’ stage.

9. Seek Teacher for Dark Night

During difficult stages of practice (Dukkha Nyanas or ‘dark night’), seek guidance from a skillful teacher to navigate fear and disillusionment without becoming disturbed.

10. Reaffirm Moment-to-Moment Noticing

When facing challenging phases, reaffirm your commitment to simply noticing things as they are being known moment-to-moment, without judgment or expectation.

11. Insight Beyond Retreats

Understand that profound spiritual insights, including stream entry, can occur in daily life outside of formal retreats, especially when paramis are cultivated consistently.

12. Study the Path

Educate yourself about the meditation path by reading books and finding out what’s involved, which helps you understand the process and what to expect.

13. Meditation for Emotional Repair

Utilize meditation practice for emotional repair, healing family-of-origin issues, and addressing other emotional challenges.

14. Redefine Enlightenment

Reframe enlightenment as a grounded, ordinary understanding of moment-to-moment life, free from suffering and entanglement, rather than a grandiose or mysterious concept.

The progress of insight is another way of saying, and this is my translation, the stuff that will allegedly happen to you or that you will allegedly experience if you do a ton of a specific kind of meditation.

Dan Harris

Enlightenment, nirvana, liberation, purification of mind, all of these terms that get thrown around that are pretty grandiose and kind of interesting and mysterious at the same time. All of that, you're saying, is just a, these are fancy ways of talking about something very normal, which is meditation practice at an advanced level shows you, allows you to see your actual life as it's unfolding right now, what you're experiencing, without the, to use your term, entanglements, without the suffering, without clinging to things that you want and pushing away things you don't want and being numbed out to the rest.

Dan Harris

But what I find fascinating about the progress of insight, other than the fact that it's controversial, and we'll talk about why in a second, is that basically the proposition is that if you do enough meditation, certain things will happen to you reliably and predictably.

Dan Harris

Buddha practiced those practices and discovered those conditions, those experiences, and he realized this is not the end. This is not the goal. This is a scenic turnout on the root.

Steve Armstrong

The spiritual goodies arise because you have good practice, but as soon as they arise, they become an object of indulgence or feeling gratified. It's that gratification with those experiences that is the corruption.

Steve Armstrong

Enlightenment is an accident. Practice makes us accident prone.

Steve Armstrong

Jerkism is an evaluation usually from other people's eyes.

Steve Armstrong

I think of it as being human. And in some ways, we become more human. Maybe not careless in being a jerk, but there are times we just – we still have our conditioning.

Steve Armstrong

Navigating the 'Dark Night' (Dukkha Nyanas)

Steve Armstrong
  1. Recognize that this is the stage of dissolution (Banga Nyanas) and the knowledge of Dukkha.
  2. Settle back and notice what you can, without looking for the kind of experience you had previously.
  3. Be comfortable, don't push, and have no expectations.
  4. Keep noticing that things are being known one after another (re-observation).
  5. Seek guidance from a skillful teacher to help navigate this stage effectively.
1975
Year of the first three-month meditation course attended by Steve Armstrong He attended the last two weeks of the course.
1976
Year the Insight Meditation Center (IMC) opened Opened in February by Jack Kornfield, Sharon Salzberg, and Joseph Goldstein.
1977
Year Steve Armstrong joined IMC staff He stayed for 8 years.
1985
Year Steve Armstrong went to Burma He spent 5 years as a monk there.
1956
Year of the Buddhist convocation in Burma where Mahasi Sayadaw was a key figure Mahasi Sayadaw was second in the hierarchy of monks to attend.
Almost 7 years
Approximate duration Dan Harris has been meditating He meditates a couple of hours a day and does several retreats.
8-9 years
Approximate duration Steve Armstrong meditated before deep insight practice Before he was continuously in retreat as a monk.
About 36 hours
Duration of a heightened experience Dan Harris had on retreat Described in his book, possibly a taste of samadhi or spiritual goodies.