The ultimate guide to SEO | Ethan Smith (Graphite)

Dec 1, 2022 Episode Page ↗
Overview

Lenny interviews Ethan Smith, CEO of Graphite, an expert in SEO. They discuss when and how companies should invest in SEO, covering strategies like programmatic and editorial SEO, team building, and common myths to help listeners master this powerful growth lever.

At a Glance
36 Insights
1h 30m Duration
16 Topics
7 Concepts

Deep Dive Analysis

Ethan Smith's Background and Graphite's Focus on SEO

Biggest Myths in SEO: Technical Audits and Over-indexing Technical SEO

When to Invest in SEO: Assessing Market Size and Authority

Three Buckets of SEO: Programmatic, Editorial, and Technical

Developing an SEO Strategy: Page Types and Content

Understanding Site Engagement as a Ranking Signal

Topics vs. Keywords: A Foundational Shift in SEO Thinking

Tools for SEO Strategy Development and Analysis

Timelines for Seeing SEO Results and Identifying Early Indicators

Hiring for SEO: Programmatic vs. Editorial Roles

Operationalizing Editorial SEO: Workflow and Scaling Content

Overcoming Roadblocks and Advocating for SEO Resources

Topical Authority: Beyond Domain Authority

The Underappreciated Power of Internal Links

The Role and Limitations of AI in Content Creation

First Steps to Explore SEO Opportunity for Your Company

Programmatic SEO

This refers to SEO strategies centered around pages automatically generated from a database, such as product pages on eBay or address pages on Zillow. It typically involves category pages (grids/lists of items) and item pages (individual products/entities).

Editorial SEO

This involves creating manually written content like articles, guides, or listicles. It's becoming increasingly important and is often the best strategy for most companies, focusing on high-quality, comprehensive content.

Technical SEO

This focuses on the underlying infrastructure of a website, including internal link architecture, tags, redirects, and page speed. It's essential for Google to find and crawl pages but is not the primary driver of growth compared to programmatic or editorial content.

Site Engagement

This refers to how users interact with your site after clicking on a Google search result. Key signals include click-through rate on Google's search results, whether users return to Google after visiting your page (pogo-sticking), and how long they stay on your page.

Topics vs. Keywords

Instead of optimizing for individual keywords, modern SEO focuses on 'topics,' which are clusters of many related keywords (200-2000 variations) that Google understands semantically. A single comprehensive page can rank for an entire topic, significantly increasing potential search volume and reducing wasted effort.

Topical Authority

This is Google's assessment of a website's expertise and credibility within a specific niche or theme, rather than just overall domain authority. It's built through various signals like non-SEO traffic, social shares, branded searches, and the anchor text of backlinks, allowing sites to outrank larger competitors in their specific areas of expertise.

Internal Links

These are hyperlinks from one page to another within the same website. They are crucial for Google to discover and crawl all pages on a site, and a well-optimized internal linking structure (spreading links widely and creating short paths from crawl points) can significantly boost traffic to otherwise underperforming pages.

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When should a company consider investing heavily in SEO?

A company should consider investing in SEO when it has a large addressable market for SEO and possesses existing traction or authority, indicated by at least 1,000 non-SEO visits per day and roughly 1,000 referring domains.

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What are the main types of SEO strategies?

The three main types of SEO are programmatic SEO (automatically generated pages from a database), editorial SEO (manually written articles and content), and technical SEO (website infrastructure like internal links and page speed).

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How do you determine the right page type for SEO success?

To determine the right page type, search for keywords you want to rank for on Google and observe the common themes and structures of the top-ranking pages. This reveals what Google considers most relevant for user intent.

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How long does it typically take to see results from SEO efforts?

It typically takes 6 to 9 months to see significant SEO results, though this can be shorter (days to weeks) for sites with high existing authority and traction, or longer (a year) for brand new sites.

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What are early indicators that an SEO strategy is working?

Early indicators include ranking at least number 20 for target keywords, seeing gradual improvements in search position (e.g., from 15 to 12 to 8), and gaining impressions and clicks, even if minimal initially.

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What kind of person should a company hire for programmatic SEO?

For programmatic SEO, a company should seek a growth person with technical ability who has a proven track record of driving SEO growth, ideally at companies that achieved high SEO percentages despite not being well-known brands.

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What kind of person should a company hire for editorial SEO?

For editorial SEO, a dedicated SEO manager is needed to define topics, create outlines, and analyze results, while a separate writer (ideally a domain expert) handles the actual content creation. The SEO manager doesn't necessarily need deep prior SEO expertise but can learn with the right workflows and tools.

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How can companies overcome internal roadblocks to implementing SEO initiatives?

Overcoming roadblocks requires integrating SEO within the product organization, securing executive-level buy-in, and effectively communicating the potential impact and ROI of SEO, which is often underestimated due to its perceived mystery and high scope.

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Why are internal links so important for SEO?

Internal links are critical because Google crawls websites through these links; without sufficient internal links, Google may not find or regularly crawl all pages. A robust internal linking strategy ensures pages are easily discoverable and receive enough credit, often leading to significant traffic increases.

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Is using AI (like GPT-3) for content generation an effective SEO strategy?

Generally, using AI like GPT-3 for content generation is not recommended because it often produces factually inaccurate or non-useful sentences, lacking underlying wisdom. AI is better suited for tasks like topic clustering, outline generation, and performance analysis, leaving content creation to human domain experts.

1. Prioritize Internal Linking

Recognize internal linking as a highly under-optimized lever; ensure all important pages have sufficient internal links (ideally 5-10+) to improve crawlability and traffic, as 90-95% of sites currently face this problem. This can lead to a 25% or even 100% increase in traffic if links are under-optimized.

2. Build Topical Authority

Focus on building deep, disproportionate authority for specific, narrow topics where you can outrank competitors with higher overall domain authority. Google’s topical authority considers not just backlinks but also non-SEO traffic, social shares, and branded search queries.

3. Allocate SEO Resources Wisely

Re-evaluate resource allocation for SEO, ensuring its budget is proportional to its potential traffic impact. For large companies spending heavily on ads, SEO investment should match the traffic potential, not be a minimal afterthought.

4. Integrate SEO with Product

Integrate SEO within the product organization and secure executive buy-in to ensure SEO initiatives are prioritized and resourced effectively. This helps overcome common blocking issues where product teams prioritize other tasks over SEO changes.

5. Assess Addressable Market Size

First, assess your SEO addressable market size by analyzing product and audience competitors’ total traffic and channel distribution using tools like Similarweb. This helps determine the potential scale of traffic you could acquire through SEO.

6. Evaluate Current Site Authority

Second, evaluate your current authority and competitiveness by checking for at least 1,000 daily non-SEO visits (direct, paid, email, social) and roughly 1,000 referring domains (backlinks). Google prioritizes credible domains that already have existing traction.

7. Compare SEO to Alternatives

Finally, compare the potential impact, cost, and scope of SEO against other growth channels (paid, social) to decide if it’s the right investment for your company now. This ensures SEO is prioritized based on its relative value and opportunity.

8. Prioritize Editorial SEO

For most companies, prioritize editorial SEO (manually created articles, guides, listicles) as it’s increasingly driving more traffic than programmatic SEO. However, choose programmatic SEO if your target queries primarily map to automatically generated page types like product listings.

9. Adopt Topic-Based Strategy

Group related keywords into broader topics, creating a single comprehensive page for each topic rather than individual pages for every keyword variation. This improves search volume accuracy for prioritization and makes content creation more efficient.

10. Determine Optimal Page Type

To determine the correct page type for a topic, search your target keywords in Google and observe the patterns of ranking page types (e.g., articles, category pages, product pages). This reverse-engineers user intent and Google’s preference for that query.

11. Optimize for User Engagement

Optimize for user engagement metrics like click-through rate from the search results page, time spent on your page, and avoiding immediate bounces back to Google. Higher engagement is a key and immediate ranking signal that causes pages to rank higher right away.

12. Structured SEO Workflow

Follow a structured SEO workflow: define the addressable market, identify target keywords/topics, determine optimal page types, define product requirements for those pages, develop a comprehensive content strategy, and ensure robust technical infrastructure.

13. Leverage UGC and Data

Utilize existing User-Generated Content (UGC), product SKUs, or data assets to lower the scope and ease of competing in SEO. The more automatically generated content you have, the easier it is to scale programmatic SEO efforts.

14. Avoid Technical Audit Focus

Don’t solely focus on technical audits (bug lists) as the primary SEO strategy; instead, prioritize a broader SEO strategy aimed at growth. Technical SEO is mainly about infrastructure, not the main driver of growth.

15. Start Editorial SEO Small

Begin editorial SEO with a modest volume of 10-30 articles per month to test performance and identify leading indicators before scaling up to 100+ articles monthly. This cautious approach helps validate the strategy before significant investment.

16. Minimum Editorial SEO Team

The minimum effective team for editorial SEO is one dedicated SEO strategist (responsible for topics, outlines, and analysis) and one writer (ideally a domain expert). The strategist focuses on identifying opportunities, and the writer creates the content.

17. Hire Programmatic SEO Expert

For programmatic SEO, seek a growth person with strong technical ability and proven experience, ideally from companies that achieved significant SEO growth without being well-known brands. This role involves analyzing competitor sites, defining product requirements, and working with engineers.

18. Hire Editorial SEO Learner

For editorial SEO, consider hiring a content-focused individual who is ‘young and hungry’ and can learn SEO workflows and tools, rather than requiring deep, long-term SEO expertise. They can become proficient with the right guidance and tools like Clearscope.

19. Analyze Competitors for Topics

Use tools like Ahrefs or SEMrush to analyze competitors’ top-performing pages and keywords to identify high-opportunity topics and content gaps. This allows you to reverse-engineer successful strategies and prioritize your content creation.

20. Use Clearscope for Content

Use Clearscope (or similar content analysis tools) to ensure your content is comprehensive and covers all necessary subtopics for a given keyword cluster. This helps fulfill user intent and improve content scores for better ranking.

21. Utilize Google Search Console

Use Google Search Console (free) for real traffic data, SERP tracking, and identifying keywords you rank for. It provides invaluable insights into your site’s performance directly from Google.

22. Consider Screaming Frog Tool

Consider using Screaming Frog (approx. $150) for advanced crawling, site audits (error codes, redirects), and analyzing internal link coverage, especially for larger sites. It helps identify structural issues and opportunities.

23. Prioritize Analysis Over Testing

Prioritize thorough analysis of competitor and your own site data to generate strong hypotheses before investing heavily in A/B testing, especially in early stages. Testing validates hypotheses, but analysis generates them.

24. Look for Early Ranking Signals

Expect SEO results to typically appear within six to nine months, but look for early leading indicators like pages ranking within the top 20 for target keywords. Even low-click impressions can validate your strategy before scaling.

25. Avoid AI for Core Content

Generally avoid using AI (like GPT-3) for generating core content, especially for sensitive topics, due to potential factual inaccuracies and lack of underlying wisdom. AI-generated text can sound correct but be factually wrong.

26. AI for SEO Workflow Tasks

Leverage AI tools for various SEO workflow tasks like keyword clustering, topic identification, subtopic outlining, and performance analysis. This allows human experts to focus on creating high-quality, factual content.

27. Leverage Adjacent Topics

Leverage existing topical authority by first creating content for semantically related or ‘adjacent’ topics, then gradually branching out to broader themes. This strategy helps build authority incrementally and rank faster.

28. Create Comprehensive Pages

Ensure your content comprehensively addresses the intent of all keywords within a topic to improve ranking and user satisfaction. If there’s a sub-theme you didn’t cover, you’re not fulfilling the intent and won’t rank as well.

29. Break Out Sub-Articles

If a specific sub-theme within a comprehensive topic isn’t ranking well despite being covered, consider creating a dedicated sub-article for it. This can help gain more authority and ranking power for that specific niche.

30. Connect with SEO Peers

Actively seek out and connect with SEO managers at successful companies to learn directly from their experiences and validated strategies. Many are willing to share what has worked and what hasn’t, saving you testing time.

31. Focus on Great Pages

Use competitor analysis as inspiration, but focus on creating genuinely great and useful pages that fulfill user intent, rather than just optimizing purely for the algorithm. This approach leads to better engagement and long-term ranking.

32. Avoid Indexing Thin Pages

For programmatic SEO, avoid indexing thin, empty, or low-quality pages (e.g., out-of-stock products without descriptions or reviews). These pages can negatively impact overall site quality and Google’s perception of your domain.

Aim for a flat internal link graph where important pages are only a few clicks away from high-authority crawl points (homepage, popular pages). Avoid a deep hierarchical tree structure, as Google needs many paths to find and crawl pages.

Implement internal links strategically within the body or at the bottom of content pages (above the footer) for maximum impact. Body links are weighted more heavily than navigational links found in footers or main navigation.

35. AI for Structured Data

Use AI for content generation when it can leverage structured, factual data to create accurate and useful sentences, such as summarizing sports scores or clinical trial information. This ensures the content is based on underlying wisdom and is factually correct.

36. Understand False Negatives

Be aware of false negatives in SEO; initial failures might indicate incorrect implementation or insufficient authority, not a lack of opportunity. It’s common for early attempts not to be implemented correctly, so re-evaluate before stopping.

I think people under-resource SEO a lot of times and over-resource ads.

Ethan Smith

The number one biggest myth are technical audits. So we, we have people reaching out saying we want a tech audit. And essentially what that is, is give me a list of bugs to fix, which is different from help me grow.

Ethan Smith

Google wants to see that you're not just an SEO site. And if you're not getting any traffic from anywhere else and it's only from SEO, then you're an SEO farm essentially.

Ethan Smith

The dirty secret of SEO and SEO consulting is that most of what is recommended never gets launched.

Ethan Smith

The fact that there's this mystery around it versus something else where there's not mystery, the non-mysterious thing will get prioritized over the mysterious thing.

Ethan Smith

Most AI-generated content is just sentences that are similar to other sentences that have been written.

Ethan Smith

SEO Strategy Development Workflow

Ethan Smith
  1. Define the addressable market by identifying topics and keywords for acquisition.
  2. Determine the appropriate page type (e.g., article, address page) for each topic based on what ranks in Google.
  3. Outline product requirements for each page type (e.g., map, phone number) by observing patterns in top-ranking pages and user needs.
  4. Develop a comprehensive content strategy, defining subtopics and themes needed for each page.
  5. Establish the infrastructure to help Google find all pages efficiently via internal links.

Editorial SEO Content Creation Workflow

Ethan Smith
  1. Identify and prioritize topics based on search volume, topical authority, and conversion intent.
  2. Develop comprehensive outlines and subtopics for each article, ensuring all relevant aspects of the topic are covered.
  3. Assign the outline to a domain expert writer to create the content.
  4. Publish the content through a CMS (e.g., Contentful, Webflow).
  5. Analyze the performance of the published content and use insights to refine the strategy.
1,000 visits/day
Minimum non-SEO daily visits for SEO investment Indicates existing traction and authority, showing the site is not just an 'SEO farm'.
1,000 referring domains
Minimum referring domains for SEO investment Indicates existing credibility and authority from external links.
200 to 2,000 keywords
Typical number of keywords a single page/topic can rank for Highlights the importance of topic-based optimization over individual keywords.
10 to 25 articles/month
Typical initial monthly article volume for editorial SEO Recommended starting volume to test performance before scaling up.
90% to 95%+
Percentage of sites with internal linking problems Indicates a widespread issue where pages lack sufficient internal links.
At least 5 links, ideally 10
Minimum internal links for Google to regularly crawl a page Ensures Google has enough paths to discover and credit a page effectively.
5% of pages get 95% of links
Typical power curve distribution of internal links on sites Illustrates how internal links are often concentrated on a small subset of pages, leaving many others under-linked.
25%+
Typical traffic opportunity from fixing internal links Potential increase in traffic, sometimes up to 100%, for sites with under-optimized internal links.