Sarah Jones Simmer: The Foundation of Trust
Sarah Jones-Simmer, CEO of Found and former COO of Bumble, shares insights on scaling businesses, effective hiring, and fundraising. She discusses navigating a cancer journey, setting boundaries, and the importance of intentional reflection and psychological safety in leadership.
Deep Dive Analysis
17 Topic Outline
Reflecting on Life with a Five-Year Timeframe
Scaling Bumble: Infrastructure and Maintaining Culture
Leverage Points in Rapid Business Growth
Navigating Employee Growth in Scaling Companies
Personal Health Journey: Cancer Diagnosis and IPO
Impact of Illness on Professional and Personal Life
Behavior Change and Accountability in Health
Found: A Platform for Evidence-Based Weight Care
Fundraising Lessons and Supporting Women Leaders
Working with Women-Led Companies and Diversity
Hiring Philosophy: Mission, Curiosity, and Versatility
Kindness Over Niceness in Professional Relationships
Creating Psychological Safety as a Leader
Remote Work: Intentionality and Building Trust
Deep Thinking and Decision-Making Processes
Value of Professional Coaching and Safe Spaces
Redefining Personal Success: Joy and Love
5 Key Concepts
T-shaped Leaders
T-shaped leaders are individuals who possess a broad range of skills and knowledge, enabling them to cover many areas, but also have the ability to go very deep on one or two specific things. This allows them to own particular responsibilities while also flexing across other areas of the business, providing leverage, especially in early-stage, rapidly scaling companies.
Kindness Over Niceness
This concept distinguishes between being merely 'nice' (avoiding discomfort) and being 'kind' (acting in someone's best interest, even if it's momentarily uncomfortable). A kind person will provide constructive feedback or point out a flaw, like spinach in teeth, because it ultimately sets the other person up for better success or a better day, fostering mutual sharpening and improvement.
Psychological Safety
Psychological safety refers to creating an environment where people feel secure enough to do their best work without fear of job insecurity, saying the wrong thing, or questioning their worth. Leaders achieve this by providing a stable foundation, being reliable, demonstrating care for employees as humans, and empowering honesty and vulnerability.
Big Deals and Little Deals
This is a personal framework for prioritizing and gaining perspective, especially after significant life events. 'Big deals' are major life challenges or priorities, while 'little deals' are minor inconveniences or anxieties. Recognizing the difference helps in not letting small issues cause disproportionate stress, allowing focus on what truly matters.
Multifactorial Weight Challenges
The challenge of weight management is far more complex than simply 'calories in, calories out' or 'eat less, exercise more.' It involves biological factors like hormones and genes, lived experiences, and social determinants of health. Addressing weight effectively requires a platform approach that considers these multiple contributing factors.
9 Questions Answered
The key is to build infrastructure and scaffolding in a systematic way that supports growth without overwhelming the initial passion and clarity of purpose. This involves building trust, developing strong analytics, and establishing operational backbones like HR and finance, while always letting the 'heart' of the business shine through.
It's important to recognize that careers come in chapters, and not everyone needs to scale endlessly with the business. The goal should be to allow individuals to contribute meaningfully for a period, then pass the baton if their sweet spot lies in a different growth phase, acknowledging their indelible imprint on the company's journey.
Her cancer journey clarified her professional purpose, making her realize she loved building and scaling teams. It led her to take on a narrower, deeper role as Chief Strategy Officer at Bumble, focusing on transformative projects like the IPO, which she found empowering and intellectually engaging, rather than being solely a patient.
Found is a platform that offers evidence-based, sustainable weight care by integrating one-on-one coaching, community support, a mobile app, and clinician-prescribed FDA-approved medication. It differentiates by acknowledging the multifactorial nature of weight (biology, hormones, genes, lived experiences) beyond just 'calories in, calories out,' focusing on self-acceptance and empowerment.
She learned that her personal health journey did not deter investors, who instead saw it as providing deeper understanding of the problem. She also reaffirmed the ongoing challenge of securing capital for women CEOs and founders, emphasizing the need to continue advocating for and investing in diverse leadership.
She prioritizes commitment to the mission, intellectual curiosity (evidenced by engagement with the product and ideas for improvement), and versatility. She seeks leaders who thrive in ambiguity, are excited to build while flying, and demonstrate kindness over mere niceness.
Leaders must ensure employees feel stable and secure, not worried about job security or saying the wrong thing. This involves being reliable, building trust through authentic human connection, being kind, and demonstrating vulnerability to encourage team members to be equally open, often requiring intentional efforts in remote settings.
She tends towards slower decision-making with conviction, prioritizing listening and gathering adequate information to achieve at least an 80% understanding of the problem. She avoids expressing opinions too early to prevent biasing others and trusts her team to provide highlights and recommendations, moving faster when that trust is established.
A professional coach provides frameworks, helps leaders arrive at decisions, offers different perspectives, and serves as a safe space to think out loud without judgment. Coaches push leaders to operate at their best, offering 'tough love' rooted in belief, and provide tools that accelerate growth and understanding.
36 Actionable Insights
1. Adopt a Five-Year Perspective
Regularly ask yourself what you would drop or what you would be disappointed not to have done if you only had five years left, to prioritize effectively and make changes on the margin.
2. Redefine Success: Joy & Love
Redefine personal success not by external metrics, but by actively finding joy in daily activities and relationships, and deeply ‘knowing’ love in all its forms (giving, receiving, understanding).
3. Daily Reflection on Joy & Love
At the end of each day, reflect on moments when you found joy and experienced love, asking yourself if it was a good day, as this practice fosters gratitude and a fulfilling way of living.
4. Embrace Career Chapters
Give yourself permission to view your career in chapters, identifying your ‘sweet spot’ and where you are the biggest force multiplier, rather than feeling pressured to endlessly scale with a business.
5. Prioritize Kindness Over Niceness
Value kindness (which involves honest, constructive feedback for someone’s benefit, like pointing out spinach in teeth) over mere niceness (which avoids discomfort but doesn’t help).
6. Create Psychological Safety
Leaders must intentionally create psychological safety so team members feel secure enough to offer honest feedback, challenge ideas, and speak up without fear of negative repercussions.
7. Build Trust Early in New Roles
When starting a new project or role, dedicate significant time to listening, understanding the business, and building trust with existing team members, as this foundation is critical and hard to re-engineer later.
8. Prioritize Excellent Hiring
Recognize that hiring well is the single biggest action you can take to gain leverage and positively shape the trajectory of your business, especially in early stages.
9. Hire T-Shaped Leaders for Leverage
Seek out ‘T-shaped’ leaders who possess a broad range of skills but can also go deep in one or two specific areas, as these individuals provide significant leverage and can adapt as the business grows.
10. Hire for Intellectual Curiosity
Look for candidates who demonstrate strong intellectual curiosity by engaging deeply with your product or problem, offering proactive, constructive feedback and ideas for improvement.
11. Prioritize Mission Commitment
When hiring, prioritize a candidate’s commitment to the mission and belief in what you’re building, as this is a deal-breaker even if they possess all the necessary hard skills.
12. Observe Small Cues for Fit
Pay attention to small behavioral cues, such as how candidates react to minor inconveniences (e.g., long lines, getting lost, running late), as these can reveal insights into their operating style and fit.
13. Build Diverse Teams for Outcomes
Actively seek to build diverse teams with varied lived experiences, including gender, race, and orientation, as this enhances perspectives and leads to higher business returns.
14. “Build a Bigger Table” Mindset
Adopt the mindset of ‘building a bigger table’ to ensure all relevant perspectives and experts are included, rather than limiting participation or creating competition for limited seats.
15. Leaders: Ask Questions, Not Answers
As a leader, recognize that your role is not to have all the answers, but to hire amazing people who do, and then to ask the right questions to propel effective decision-making.
16. Practice Slow, Conviction-Based Decisions
Adopt a slower, conviction-based approach to decision-making by framing the problem, then actively listening and gathering information until you have at least an 80% understanding, avoiding premature opinions that can bias others.
17. Trust Leaders, Mediate Conflicts
Trust your great leaders to provide well-researched recommendations with supporting data, and take extra time to mediate when trusted individuals have conflicting points of view on a decision.
18. Provide Stability for Peak Performance
As a leader, create conditions for people to do their best work by ensuring job security, fostering trust, demonstrating kindness, and providing a firm, reliable foundation.
19. Engineer “Long Thinking” Time
Intentionally carve out distraction-free time, such as long walks (ideally in nature) or dedicated ‘flow days’ with no meetings, to allow for deeper introspection, creative thought, and longer attention spans.
20. Stick with Problems Longer
Cultivate the ability to stick with a problem for longer than others, as your first thoughts are rarely your best, and sustained focus offers a unique advantage and deeper perspective.
21. Focus on Outcomes, Not Hours
Shift focus from hours worked to outcomes achieved, recognizing that strategic breaks like naps or walks can leverage your working time and make you more effective.
22. Prioritize Health Breaks for Focus
Intentionally schedule time for physical activity, like a two-hour weightlifting session during the workday, as it not only addresses health needs but also leads to sharper thinking and renewed perspective.
23. Prioritize Strength Training for Health
Incorporate lifting heavy weights, such as kettlebells, into your routine (e.g., twice a week) to strengthen bones and improve overall health, especially if at risk.
24. Find Accountability Partners
Seek out a cohort or other individuals who can hold you accountable and share similar experiences, as this shared journey significantly reinforces behavior change and provides support.
25. Leverage Tech for Behavior Change
Utilize technology, such as ‘streaks’ or reminders, to reinforce positive daily behaviors like taking medication, exercising, or taking breaks, counteracting its potential for distraction.
26. Invest Heavily in People & HR
Go beyond basic HR functions by investing heavily in developing a performance review cycle, fostering culture and communication, and equipping emerging managers to support a rapidly growing team.
27. Utilize Analytics as Growth Multiplier
Establish a robust analytics function early in a scaling business to surface real insights, help all departments get smarter, and act as a significant leverage point for growth.
28. Adjust Role During Personal Crisis
During significant personal challenges, consider restructuring your role to be narrower and deeper, focusing your limited emotional bandwidth on critical tasks and personal well-being.
29. Daily Reflection for Work-Life
In the evenings, reflect on ‘what you blocked, what you advanced, and how you made people feel’ to gain clarity and permission to transition into personal time.
30. Create Physical Work Transitions
To signal the beginning and end of the workday in a remote setting, take a physical break like walking around the block to create a clear boundary between work and personal life.
31. Intentionally Build Remote Trust
In remote work environments, be highly intentional about building trust by scheduling periodic in-person meetings, engaging in informal virtual interactions (e.g., walking phone calls), and engineering authentic human connections.
32. Leaders: Demonstrate Vulnerability
As a leader, intentionally share personal, authentic, or vulnerable stories (e.g., embarrassing moments, hard-learned lessons) to engender trust and give team members permission to be vulnerable themselves.
33. Define Clear Communication Channels
Establish clear norms for communication channels (e.g., Slack for daily workflow, email for external/context-heavy, text for urgent, phone calls for nuanced discussions) to optimize effectiveness and reduce confusion.
34. Utilize Phone Calls for Trust
Don’t shy away from picking up the phone to talk to someone, especially when something is being lost in translation or to build trust, as voice-on-voice communication is more effective than text-based.
35. Get a Professional Coach
Overcome the stigma of seeking external help and engage a professional coach to provide frameworks, offer different perspectives, and create a safe space for thinking out loud and personal/professional growth.
36. Invest in Quality Relationships
Actively invest in friendships and family relationships to create safe spaces for authentic self-expression, reflection, and addressing challenges without fear or mistrust, enriching your life quality.
5 Key Quotes
It wasn't a failed marriage. It was a great marriage while it lasted. And then it was over.
Sarah Jones Simmer
What are the things that I would drop if I actually only had five years? What would I be so disappointed that I didn't do if I only had five years?
Sarah Jones Simmer
A kind person will tell you, you have spinach in your teeth and a nice person won't because it's uncomfortable, right? But the kind person is going to set you up for a much better rest of your day because you're not running around with spinach in your teeth.
Sarah Jones Simmer
It's not my job to know everything about everything. It's my job to hire amazing people who can round that out. And then I need to be the one that can ask the right questions so that I can help propel that decision making.
Sarah Jones Simmer
For me, success now is, is finding joy and knowing love truly as Pollyanna as that may sound. Like, how do I find joy in my life? How do I find joy in the set of activities that I do in the time that I spend with my kids? Like joy is the word that is emblazoned on my brain. And, and how do I know love?
Sarah Jones Simmer
2 Protocols
Evening Reflection Practice
Sarah Jones Simmer- Ask: What am I blocking?
- Ask: What am I advancing?
- Ask: How did I make people feel?
Flow Wednesdays Work Rhythm
Sarah Jones Simmer- Hold no meetings or at least no recurring meetings.
- Use the time for long thinking, ideally in nature.
- Engage in activities like walking with a cup of coffee to foster creative thought.